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Cheney to China: The Obama interview

(CNN) — As his popularity has dropped to 45%, the lowest in a year and a half, President Barack Obama talked with PBS’ Charlie Rose.

The president covered a world of issues, including how some critics now liken him to a particular Republican adversary. Here are his thoughts on seven of the topics he discussed on Monday evening.

Obama as the new Dick Cheney?

When asked if there is enough transparency in how government seeks secret court orders to obtain phone records, Obama abruptly brought up former Vice President Dick Cheney, who served under President George W. Bush.

“Some people say well, Obama was this raving liberal before, now he’s Dick Cheney. Dick Cheney sometimes says, ‘Yes, you know, he took it all, lock stock and barrel,’” Obama said, referring to the Bush-Cheney security agenda.

Obama bristles at suggestion he has shifted on snooping

“My concern has always been not that we shouldn’t do intelligence gathering to prevent terrorism but rather are we setting up a system of checks and balances?” Obama added.

His administration has advanced checks on security initiatives, he said. “You know, what amuses me is now folks on the right who were fine when it was a Republican president but now Obama’s coming in with a black helicopter,” Obama added.

Obama asserted that the process of securing secret rulings from the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act court is transparent and is examined by the U.S. Justice Department and Congress.

On surveillance

In the wake of revelations that his administration secured a secret court order to obtain Verizon phone logs, the president assured Americans that the National Security Agency isn’t listening to phone calls or targeting personal e-mails — unless the government has a specific court order to do so.

Obama’s job is to balance national security and personal freedom.

“To say there’s a trade-off doesn’t mean somehow that we’ve abandoned freedom. I don’t think anybody says we’re no longer free because we have checkpoints at airports,” Obama said.

“My job is both to protect the American people and to protect the American way of life, which includes our privacy. And so every program that we engage in, what I’ve said is, let’s examine and make sure that we’re making the right tradeoffs,” Obama added.

His top priorities

National security is Obama’s No. 1 priority, he said, but he quickly added he hasn’t forgotten you — the working person now reeling in the recession’s aftermath and struggling to find or keep a job.

That’s why he became president in the first place, he said.

“The biggest challenge we face right now, in addition to the ongoing challenge of national security, is having recovered from the worst recession since the Great Depression, having dug our way out, with the economy now growing, jobs being created, auto industry back, stock market back, housing recovering by about 10% in terms of prices,” Obama said, “how do we now go back to the issue that led me to run for president in the first place — which is the fact that the economy is not working for everybody, that we have the structural problems that could lead us to second-rate status if they continue.”

Growing economic inequality and declining wages for middle-class families is occurring in the United States — and “worldwide,” Obama added — because of globalization and technology.

“We’ve got to address that if we are going to continue to be the greatest nation on Earth,” the president said. “And that is the thing that I’m going to be focused on for the remainder of my presidency, along with the basics like making sure nobody blows us up.”

Iran’s new president

Obama noted how the newly elected president of Iran, Hassan Rouhani, is a centrist, which gives Obama optimism that Iran may now want to seriously address its nuclear program, which many feel is being used to eventually build weapons. In response, Iran is now being internationally punished with “the most powerful” economic sanctions ever applied against it, Obama said.

“The Iranian people rebuffed the hardliners and the clerics in the election who were counseling no compromise on anything, anytime, anywhere,” Obama said. “Clearly you have a hunger within Iran to engage with the international community in a more positive way.

U.S. takes ‘wait and see’ stance on Iran’s new president

“Our bottom lines have been, show the international community that you’re abiding by international treaties and obligations, that you’re not developing a nuclear weapon.”

Supporting Syrian opposition

Though his administration has declared that Syrian President Bashar al-Assad used chemical weapons in his country’s two-year civil war, and as a result he has pledged military support for the opposition, Obama avoided specifying what kind of military support that will be.

What complicates the matter is how some of the Syrian opposition is affiliated with al Qaeda.

G8 leaders agree on need but not methods to stop Syrian bloodshed

“One of the challenges that we have is that some of the most effective fighters within the opposition have been those who, frankly, are not particularly friendly toward the United States of America. And arming them willy-nilly is not a good recipe for meeting American interests over the long term,” Obama said.

He also spoke of avoiding a sectarian Islamic quagmire between Shiites and Sunnis in Syria.

The United States has learned some hard lessons from the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, he said.

“We know what it’s like to rush into a war in the Middle East without having thought it through. And there are elements within the Middle East who see this entirely through the prism of a Shia/Sunni conflict and want the United States to simply take the side of the Sunnis. And that I do not think serves American interests,” Obama said.

“Now on the other side there are folks who say, ‘You know we are so scarred from Iraq, we should have learned our lesson, we should not have anything to do with it.’

“Well I reject that view as well because the fact of the matter is that we’ve got serious interests there and not only humanitarian interests. We can’t have a situation of ongoing chaos in a major country that borders a country like Jordan, which in turn borders Israel. And we have a legitimate need to be engaged and to be involved.”

Meeting with China on alleged hacking

Last week, Obama met with new Chinese President Xi Jinping.

The U.S. president broached the serious allegations of hacking against China.

“You know, when you’re having a conversation like this I don’t think you ever expect a Chinese leader to say, ‘You know what? You’re right. You caught us red-handed. We’re just stealing all your stuff and every day we try to figure out how we can get into Apple,’” Obama said.

‘New model’ for U.S.-China relations

But, he added: “We had a very blunt conversation about cybersecurity” with the Chinese president.

Ben Bernanke on way out?

Asked if he is going to reappoint Ben Bernanke to a third term as Federal Reserve chairman, Obama sidestepped a direct answer, opening the door to speculation that Bernanke’s tenure may be ending.

“He’s already stayed a lot longer than he wanted, or he was supposed to,” Obama said. “He has been an outstanding partner along with the White House in helping us recover much stronger than, for example, our European partners from what could have been an economic crisis of epic proportions.”

Bernanke led the central bank’s response to the global financial collapse that began in fall 2007, keeping interest rates at historic lows and shepherding a massive Fed intervention in the government bond market.

He became chairman in February 2006 as an appointee of President George W. Bush. Obama appointed Bernanke to a second term in 2010. Bernanke’s term expires on January 31, 2014.


Article source: http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/18/politics/obama-seven-things/index.html?eref=edition

Article source: http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/NewsRipplesWeb/~3/hTKMJ3RpBbY/cheney-to-china-the-obama-interview

Has U.S. started internet war?

Editor’s note: Bruce Schneier is a security technologist and author of “Liars and Outliers: Enabling the Trust Society Needs to Survive.”

(CNN) — Today, the United States is conducting offensive cyberwar actions around the world.

More than passively eavesdropping, we’re penetrating and damaging foreign networks for both espionage and to ready them for attack. We’re creating custom-designed Internet weapons, pre-targeted and ready to be “fired” against some piece of another country’s electronic infrastructure on a moment’s notice.

This is much worse than what we’re accusing China of doing to us. We’re pursuing policies that are both expensive and destabilizing and aren’t making the Internet any safer. We’re reacting from fear, and causing other countries to counter-react from fear. We’re ignoring resilience in favor of offense.

Bruce Schneier

Welcome to the cyberwar arms race, an arms race that will define the Internet in the 21st century.

Presidential Policy Directive 20, issued last October and released by Edward Snowden, outlines U.S. cyberwar policy. Most of it isn’t very interesting, but there are two paragraphs about “Offensive Cyber Effect Operations,” or OCEO, that are intriguing:

“OECO can offer unique and unconventional capabilities to advance U.S. national objectives around the world with little or no warning to the adversary or target and with potential effects ranging from subtle to severely damaging. The development and sustainment of OCEO capabilities, however, may require considerable time and effort if access and tools for a specific target do not already exist.

“The United States Government shall identify potential targets of national importance where OCEO can offer a favorable balance of effectiveness and risk as compared with other instruments of national power, establish and maintain OCEO capabilities integrated as appropriate with other U.S. offensive capabilities, and execute those capabilities in a manner consistent with the provisions of this directive.”

Opinion: Cyber arms control? Forget about it


Obama: NSA programs are transparent


Releasing NSA leaks: A public service?


NSA fallout could be ‘harmful’


Could the NSA leaker defect to China?

These two paragraphs, and another paragraph about OCEO, are the only parts of the document classified “top secret.” And that’s because what they’re saying is very dangerous.

Cyberattacks have the potential to be both immediate and devastating. They can disrupt communications systems, disable national infrastructure, or, as in the case of Stuxnet, destroy nuclear reactors; but only if they’ve been created and targeted beforehand. Before launching cyberattacks against another country, we have to go through several steps.

We have to study the details of the computer systems they’re running and determine the vulnerabilities of those systems. If we can’t find exploitable vulnerabilities, we need to create them: leaving “back doors” in hacker speak. Then we have to build new cyberweapons designed specifically to attack those systems.

Sometimes we have to embed the hostile code in those networks, these are called “logic bombs,” to be unleashed in the future. And we have to keep penetrating those foreign networks, because computer systems always change and we need to ensure that the cyberweapons are still effective.

Like our nuclear arsenal during the Cold War, our cyberweapons arsenal must be pretargeted and ready to launch.

class="cnn_storypgraphtxt cnn_storypgraph14">That’s what Obama directed the U.S. Cyber Command to do. We can see glimpses in how effective we are in Snowden’s
allegations that the NSA is currently penetrating foreign networks around the world: “We hack network backbones — like huge Internet routers, basically — that give us access to the communications of hundreds of thousands of computers without having to hack every single one.”

The NSA and the U.S. Cyber Command are basically the same thing. They’re both at Fort Meade in Maryland, and they’re both led by Gen. Keith Alexander. The same people who hack network backbones are also building weapons to destroy those backbones. At a March Senate briefing, Alexander boasted of creating more than a dozen offensive cyber units.

Longtime NSA watcher James Bamford reached the same conclusion in his recent profile of Alexander and the U.S. Cyber Command (written before the Snowden revelations). He discussed some of the many cyberweapons the U.S. purchases:

“According to Defense News’ C4ISR Journal and Bloomberg Businessweek, Endgame also offers its intelligence clients — agencies like Cyber Command, the NSA, the CIA, and British intelligence — a unique map showing them exactly where their targets are located. Dubbed Bonesaw, the map displays the geolocation and digital address of basically every device connected to the Internet around the world, providing what’s called network situational awareness. The client locates a region on the password-protected web-based map, then picks a country and city — say, Beijing, China. Next the client types in the name of the target organization, such as the Ministry of Public Security’s No. 3 Research Institute, which is responsible for computer security — or simply enters its address, 6 Zhengyi Road. The map will then display what software is running on the computers inside the facility, what types of malware some may contain, and a menu of custom-designed exploits that can be used to secretly gain entry. It can also pinpoint those devices infected with malware, such as the Conficker worm, as well as networks turned into botnets and zombies — the equivalent of a back door left open…

“The buying and using of such a subscription by nation-states could be seen as an act of war. ‘If you are engaged in reconnaissance on an adversary’s systems, you are laying the electronic battlefield and preparing to use it’ wrote Mike Jacobs, a former NSA director for information assurance, in a McAfee report on cyberwarfare. ‘In my opinion, these activities constitute acts of war, or at least a prelude to future acts of war.’ The question is, who else is on the secretive company’s client list? Because there is as of yet no oversight or regulation of the cyberweapons trade, companies in the cyber-industrial complex are free to sell to whomever they wish. “It should be illegal,’ said the former senior intelligence official involved in cyberwarfare. ‘I knew about Endgame when I was in intelligence. The intelligence community didn’t like it, but they’re the largest consumer of that business.’”

That’s the key question: How much of what the United States is currently doing is an act of war by international definitions? Already we’re accusing China of penetrating our systems in order to map “military capabilities that could be exploited during a crisis.” What PPD-20 and Snowden describe is much worse, and certainly China, and other countries, are doing the same.

All of this mapping of vulnerabilities and keeping them secret for offensive use makes the Internet less secure, and these pre-targeted, ready-to-unleash cyberweapons are destabalizing forces on international relationships. Rooting around other countries’ networks, analyzing vulnerabilities, creating back doors, and leaving logic bombs could easily be construed as an act of war. And all it takes is one over-achieving national leader for this all to tumble into actual war.

It’s time to stop the madness. Yes, our military needs to invest in cyberwar capabilities, but we also need international rules of cyberwar, more transparency from our own government on what we are and are not doing, international cooperation between governments and viable cyberweapons treaties. Yes, these are difficult. Yes, it’s a long slow process. Yes, there won’t be international consensus, certainly not in the beginning. But even with all of those problems, it’s a better path to go down than the one we’re on now.

We can start by taking most of the money we’re investing in offensive cyberwar capabilities and spend them on national cyberspace resilience. MAD, mutually assured destruction, made sense because there were two superpowers opposing each other. On the Internet there are all sorts of different powers, from nation-states to much less organized groups. An arsenal of cyberweapons begs to be used, and, as we learned from Stuxnet, there’s always collateral damage to innocents when they are. We’re much safer with a strong defense than with a counterbalancing offense.

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The opinions expressed in this commentary are solely those of Bruce Schneier.


Article source: http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/18/opinion/schneier-cyberwar-policy/index.html?eref=edition

Article source: http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/NewsRipplesWeb/~3/QBs6tF1QnlQ/has-u-s-started-internet-war

Hong Kong chants: ‘NSA has no say’


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Several hundred protesters took to Hong Kong's streets on Saturday to support Edward Snowden, a week after the 29-year-old whistleblower behind the U.S. National Security Agency's mass surveillance program revealed he was hiding out in the city.Several hundred protesters took to Hong Kong’s streets on Saturday to support Edward Snowden, a week after the 29-year-old whistleblower behind the U.S. National Security Agency’s mass surveillance program revealed he was hiding out in the city.

The rain led protesters determined to show their support to prepare laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans. The rain led protesters determined to show their support to prepare laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans.

Protesters and media gathered in Chater Garden in the city's business district to kick off the three-hour protest.Protesters and media gathered in Chater Garden in the city’s business district to kick off the three-hour protest.

We're rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law, said blogger-activist and protest co-organizer Tom Grundy (L).“We’re rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law,” said blogger-activist and protest co-organizer Tom Grundy (L).

The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it's been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale. If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is...anyone ever going to start a revolution? said Claudio Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature.“The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it’s been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale. If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is…anyone ever going to start a revolution?” said Claudio Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature.

Standing in Chater Garden in the city's business district, Hong Kong legislator Albert Ho said the protest was a march for justice.Standing in Chater Garden in the city’s business district, Hong Kong legislator Albert Ho said the protest was a “march for justice.”

The protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public and media. The protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public and media.

 Organizers announced an overall turnout of 900 protesters, while police cited a peak turnout of 300. Organizers announced an overall turnout of 900 protesters, while police cited a peak turnout of 300.

Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, 8, and Jade, 3, to the protest, who held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden's image. It's not just about our generation, but the next generation as well, Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother's sentiment: When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, 8, and Jade, 3, to the protest, who held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden’s image. “It’s not just about our generation, but the next generation as well,” Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother’s sentiment: “When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.”

As Americans, it's kind of disheartening to know (the surveillance program) is going on behind our backs and we don't have a say in it, said Adi Koul (R), a University of Texas student studying abroad in Hong Kong. It's empowering to see people who aren't necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.!-- --/br“As Americans, it’s kind of disheartening to know (the surveillance program) is going on behind our backs and we don’t have a say in it,” said Adi Koul (R), a University of Texas student studying abroad in Hong Kong. “It’s empowering to see people who aren’t necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.”

In a televised interview with Bloomberg on Wednesday on how Hong Kong would handle Snowden's case, Leung repeatedly responded that he does not comment on individual cases. His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.In a televised interview with Bloomberg on Wednesday on how Hong Kong would handle Snowden’s case, Leung repeatedly responded that he “does not comment on individual cases.” His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.

Protesters unfurl a banner en route to the U.S. consulate, where organizers presented an open letter addressed to ambassador Stephen Young. Protesters unfurl a banner en route to the U.S. consulate, where organizers presented an open letter addressed to ambassador Stephen Young.

George Orwell's concept of Big Brother dominated much of the signage and discourse.George Orwell’s concept of “Big Brother” dominated much of the signage and discourse.

Hong Kong legislator Long Hair spoke to the crowd at the second rallying point outside the U.S. consulate.Hong Kong legislator “Long Hair” spoke to the crowd at the second rallying point outside the U.S. consulate.

Police at the Hong Kong government headquarters in Tamar blocked off most of the square with two circles of fences, forcing protesters into a narrow outer perimeter.Police at the Hong Kong government headquarters in Tamar blocked off most of the square with two circles of fences, forcing protesters into a narrow outer perimeter.


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Hong Kong (CNN) — When U.S. citizen Edward Snowden decided to flee to Hong Kong because of its “spirited commitment to free speech and the right of political dissent,” he may not have anticipated that some in the city would launch a protest backing him.

Several hundred demonstrators took to Hong Kong’s streets in the rain Saturday voicing support for Snowden a week after the 29-year-old computer technician, who is believed to be hiding out somewhere in the city, revealed himself as the source of leaked documents exposing an international surveillance program of internet and telephone communications operated by the U.S. National Security Agency (NSA).

The revelation of his presence — as well as his claims that Hong Kong had been subject to the surveillance — has sparked heated speculation whether Hong Kong, a special administrative region — one that is semi-autonomous — of the People’s Republic of China, would prove to be a safe haven for him. Snowden said his intention was to “ask the courts and people of Hong Kong to decide my fate.”


Former U.S. spy talks Snowden’s future


Support for Edward Snowden in Hong Kong


Snowden: U.S. hacked targets in China


Could the NSA leaker defect to China?

“We’re rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law,” said blogger, activist and protest organizer Tom Grundy.

Amid the blowing of whistles and chants of “Protect Snowden!” and “NSA has no say!” the protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public as well as media. Under the drizzling sky, protesters determined to show their support held laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans.

Adi Koul and Jesus Meza, students from the University of Texas at Austin who are studying abroad in Hong Kong, said they found the protest “really refreshing.”

“As Americans, it’s kind of disheartening to know [the surveillance program] is going on behind our backs and we don’t have a say in it,” said Koul. “It’s empowering to see people who aren’t necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.”

Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, aged eight, and three-year-old Jade, along to the protest; the children held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden’s image. “It’s not just about our generation, but the next generation as well,” Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother’s sentiment: “When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.”

Organizers claimed an overall turnout of 900 protesters; police said the demonstration had a peak turnout of 300 — a relatively small showing compared to major protests in Hong Kong, which have attracted hundreds of thousands of people. Grundy said plans for the protest only began on Monday, and that he would be pleased if 1,000 people turned out in the end.

The three-hour protest, which kicked off in a garden in the city’s business district and went on to the U.S. consulate and the Hong Kong government headquarters, failed to gain a strong sense of momentum, hampered in part by the narrow looping route allocated by the city’s authorities. At each rallying point, only a small group was able to gather around to hear the keynote speakers; most protesters were relegated to standing single or double file some distance away. By the time the protest moved outside the government headquarters to deliver an open letter to the city’s leader, Chief Executive C.Y. Leung, the crowd had dropped to about 100 people.

Snowden’s arrival in the city has heightened simmering fears about the ever-encroaching hand of Beijing in the city’s affairs and freedoms.

While Hong Kong has its own de facto constitution, judiciary, and legal system under the “one country two systems” policy, a deep mistrust runs in the city toward the government under Leung, who is widely viewed as being under the thumb of the Chinese central government.

In a televised interview with Bloomberg Wednesday, Leung repeatedly insisted he “does not comment on individual cases,” when asked how Hong Kong would handle Snowden’s case. His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.

“Judging from [this interview], I think he’s waiting for instructions from Beijing,” said Oiwan Lam, a blogger and activist with in-media, the civil advocacy group that organized the protest with Grundy.


Holder: Leaks ‘extremely damaging’


Vetting federal contractors


Inside the mind of Edward Snowden


NSA leaker, girlfriend still in hiding

According to Hong Kong law, if the U.S. was to request the city to surrender Snowden, Beijing could step in only if its defence or foreign affairs would be significantly affected by Hong Kong’s actions. Beijing is not allowed to interfere with any asylum proceedings.

Nevertheless, many have expressed fears that Beijing will quietly influence Hong Kong’s handling of Snowden’s case.

“Hong Kong’s decisions are all based on the Chinese government,” said Sherry Hung, 24, a graduate student at Hong Kong Baptist University. “I don’t think Hong Kong can help Snowden,” she added, although she said it was important to show her support at the protest.

Others also note that Hong Kong has a track record of cooperating with the United States. In particular, they fear Hong Kong will not respect due process in the Snowden case, instead enabling him to be quietly whisked away. Local media in Hong Kong last year reported on the case of a Libyan dissident who launched legal action against the city’s government, accusing them of aiding in his “extraordinary rendition” and subsequent torture in prison.

“The biggest Western government — the U.S government — is his enemy. Now he can only count on us, the power of Hong Kong civil society and our legal system,” Ip Lam Chong of in-media told protesters. “I see this incident as a stress test for Hong Kong society and its legal system.”

Claudia Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature who addressed the protesters, said the city of Hong Kong “owes Snowden at least some response.”

“The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it’s been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale,” she said. “If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is… anyone ever going to start a revolution?”


Article source: http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/15/world/asia/hong-kong-snowden-protest/index.html?eref=edition

Article source: http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/NewsRipplesWeb/~3/CoTTnRjK2rs/hong-kong-chants-nsa-has-no-say

Hong Kong rallies for Edward Snowden


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Several hundred protesters took to Hong Kong's streets on Saturday to support Edward Snowden, a week after the 29-year-old whistleblower behind the U.S. National Security Agency's mass surveillance program revealed he was hiding out in the city.Several hundred protesters took to Hong Kong’s streets on Saturday to support Edward Snowden, a week after the 29-year-old whistleblower behind the U.S. National Security Agency’s mass surveillance program revealed he was hiding out in the city.

The rain led protesters determined to show their support to prepare laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans. The rain led protesters determined to show their support to prepare laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans.

Protesters and media gathered in Chater Garden in the city's business district to kick off the three-hour protest.Protesters and media gathered in Chater Garden in the city’s business district to kick off the three-hour protest.

We're rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law, said blogger-activist and protest co-organizer Tom Grundy (L).“We’re rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law,” said blogger-activist and protest co-organizer Tom Grundy (L).

The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it's been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale. If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is...anyone ever going to start a revolution? said Claudio Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature.“The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it’s been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale. If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is…anyone ever going to start a revolution?” said Claudio Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature.

Standing in Chater Garden in the city's business district, Hong Kong legislator Albert Ho said the protest was a march for justice.Standing in Chater Garden in the city’s business district, Hong Kong legislator Albert Ho said the protest was a “march for justice.”

The protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public and media. The protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public and media.

 Organizers announced an overall turnout of 900 protesters, while police cited a peak turnout of 300. Organizers announced an overall turnout of 900 protesters, while police cited a peak turnout of 300.

Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, 8, and Jade, 3, to the protest, who held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden’s image. “It’s not just about our generation, but the next generation as well,” Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother’s sentiment: “When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.”

As Americans, it's kind of disheartening to know (the surveillance program) is going on behind our backs and we don't have a say in it, said Adi Koul (R), a University of Texas student studying abroad in Hong Kong. It's empowering to see people who aren't necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.!-- --/br“As Americans, it’s kind of disheartening to know (the surveillance program) is going on behind our backs and we don’t have a say in it,” said Adi Koul (R), a University of Texas student studying abroad in Hong Kong. “It’s empowering to see people who aren’t necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.”

In a televised interview with Bloomberg on Wednesday on how Hong Kong would handle Snowden's case, Leung repeatedly responded that he does not comment on individual cases. His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.In a televised interview with Bloomberg on Wednesday on how Hong Kong would handle Snowden’s case, Leung repeatedly responded that he “does not comment on individual cases.” His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.

Protesters unfurl a banner en route to the U.S. consulate, where organizers presented an open letter addressed to ambassador Stephen Young. Protesters unfurl a banner en route to the U.S. consulate, where organizers presented an open letter addressed to ambassador Stephen Young.

George Orwell's concept of Big Brother dominated much of the signage and discourse.George Orwell’s concept of “Big Brother” dominated much of the signage and discourse.

Hong Kong legislator Long Hair spoke to the crowd at the second rallying point outside the U.S. consulate.Hong Kong legislator “Long Hair” spoke to the crowd at the second rallying point outside the U.S. consulate.

Police at the Hong Kong government headquarters in Tamar blocked off most of the square with two circles of fences, forcing protesters into a narrow outer perimeter.Police at the Hong Kong government headquarters in Tamar blocked off most of the square with two circles of fences, forcing protesters into a narrow outer perimeter.


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Hong Kong (CNN) — When U.S. citizen Edward Snowden decided to flee to Hong Kong because of its “spirited commitment to free speech and the right of political dissent,” he may not have anticipated that some in the city would launch a protest backing him.

Several hundred demonstrators took to Hong Kong’s streets in the rain Saturday voicing support for Snowden a week after the 29-year-old computer technician, who is believed to be hiding out somewhere in the city, revealed himself as the source of leaked documents exposing an international surveillance program of internet and telephone communications operated by the U.S. National Security Agency (NSA).

The revelation of his presence — as well as his claims that Hong Kong had been subject to the surveillance — has sparked heated speculation whether Hong Kong, a special administrative region — one that is semi-autonomous — of the People’s Republic of China, would prove to be a safe haven for him. Snowden said his intention was to “ask the courts and people of Hong Kong to decide my fate.”


Former U.S. spy talks Snowden’s future


Support for Edward Snowden in Hong Kong


Snowden: U.S. hacked targets in China


Could the NSA leaker defect to China?

“We’re rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law,” said blogger, activist and protest organizer Tom Grundy.

Amid the blowing of whistles and chants of “Protect Snowden!” and “NSA has no say!” the protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public as well as media. Under the drizzling sky, protesters determined to show their support held laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans.

Adi Koul and Jesus Meza, students from the University of Texas at Austin who are studying abroad in Hong Kong, said they found the protest “really refreshing.”

“As Americans, it’s kind of disheartening to know [the surveillance program] is going on behind our backs and we don’t have a say in it,” said Koul. “It’s empowering to see people who aren’t necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.”

Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, aged eight, and three-year-old Jade, along to the protest; the children held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden’s image. “It’s not just about our generation, but the next generation as well,” Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother’s sentiment: “When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.”

Organizers claimed an overall turnout of 900 protesters; police said the demonstration had a peak turnout of 300 — a relatively small showing compared to major protests in Hong Kong, which have attracted hundreds of thousands of people. Grundy said plans for the protest only began on Monday, and that he would be pleased if 1,000 people turned out in the end.

The three-hour protest, which kicked off in a garden in the city’s business district and went on to the U.S. consulate and the Hong Kong government headquarters, failed to gain a strong sense of momentum, hampered in part by the narrow looping route allocated by the city’s authorities. At each rallying point, only a small group was able to gather around to hear the keynote speakers; most protesters were relegated to standing single or double file some distance away. By the time the protest moved outside the government headquarters to deliver an open letter to the city’s leader, Chief Executive C.Y. Leung, the crowd had dropped to about 100 people.

Snowden’s arrival in the city has heightened simmering fears about the ever-encroaching hand of Beijing in the city’s affairs and freedoms.

While Hong Kong has its own de facto constitution, judiciary, and legal system under the “one country two systems” policy, a deep mistrust runs in the city toward the government under Leung, who is widely viewed as being under the thumb of the Chinese central government.

In a televised interview with Bloomberg Wednesday, Leung repeatedly insisted he “does not comment on individual cases,” when asked how Hong Kong would handle Snowden’s case. His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.

“Judging from [this interview], I think he’s waiting for instructions from Beijing,” said Oiwan Lam, a blogger and activist with in-media, the civil advocacy group that organized the protest with Grundy.


Holder: Leaks ‘extremely damaging’


Vetting federal contractors


Inside the mind of Edward Snowden


NSA leaker, girlfriend still in hiding

According to Hong Kong law, if the U.S. was to request the city to surrender Snowden, Beijing could step in only if its defence or foreign affairs would be significantly affected by Hong Kong’s actions. Beijing is not allowed to interfere with any asylum proceedings.

Nevertheless, many have expressed fears that Beijing will quietly influence Hong Kong’s handling of Snowden’s case.

“Hong Kong’s decisions are all based on the Chinese government,” said Sherry Hung, 24, a graduate student at Hong Kong Baptist University. “I don’t think Hong Kong can help Snowden,” she added, although she said it was important to show her support at the protest.

Others also note that Hong Kong has a track record of cooperating with the United States. In particular, they fear Hong Kong will not respect due process in the Snowden case, instead enabling him to be quietly whisked away. Local media in Hong Kong last year reported on the case of a Libyan dissident who launched legal action against the city’s government, accusing them of aiding in his “extraordinary rendition” and subsequent torture in prison.

“The biggest Western government — the U.S government — is his enemy. Now he can only count on us, the power of Hong Kong civil society and our legal system,” Ip Lam Chong of in-media told protesters. “I see this incident as a stress test for Hong Kong society and its legal system.”

Claudia Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature who addressed the protesters, said the city of Hong Kong “owes Snowden at least some response.”

“The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it’s been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale,” she said. “If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is… anyone ever going to start a revolution?”


Article source: http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/15/world/asia/hong-kong-snowden-protest/index.html?eref=edition

Article source: http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/NewsRipplesWeb/~3/Sih-uaPCCzU/hong-kong-rallies-for-edward-snowden

Hong Kong rallies for Edward Snowden


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Several hundred protesters took to Hong Kong's streets on Saturday to support Edward Snowden, a week after the 29-year-old whistleblower behind the U.S. National Security Agency's mass surveillance program revealed he was hiding out in the city.Several hundred protesters took to Hong Kong’s streets on Saturday to support Edward Snowden, a week after the 29-year-old whistleblower behind the U.S. National Security Agency’s mass surveillance program revealed he was hiding out in the city.

The rain led protesters determined to show their support to prepare laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans. The rain led protesters determined to show their support to prepare laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans.

Protesters and media gathered in Chater Garden in the city's business district to kick off the three-hour protest.Protesters and media gathered in Chater Garden in the city’s business district to kick off the three-hour protest.

We're rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law, said blogger-activist and protest co-organizer Tom Grundy (L).“We’re rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law,” said blogger-activist and protest co-organizer Tom Grundy (L).

The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it's been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale. If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is...anyone ever going to start a revolution? said Claudio Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature.“The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it’s been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale. If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is…anyone ever going to start a revolution?” said Claudio Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature.

Standing in Chater Garden in the city's business district, Hong Kong legislator Albert Ho said the protest was a march for justice.Standing in Chater Garden in the city’s business district, Hong Kong legislator Albert Ho said the protest was a “march for justice.”

The protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public and media. The protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public and media.

 Organizers announced an overall turnout of 900 protesters, while police cited a peak turnout of 300. Organizers announced an overall turnout of 900 protesters, while police cited a peak turnout of 300.

Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, 8, and Jade, 3, to the protest, who held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden's image. It's not just about our generation, but the next generation as well, Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother's sentiment: When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, 8, and Jade, 3, to the protest, who held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden’s image. “It’s not just about our generation, but the next generation as well,” Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother’s sentiment: “When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.”

As Americans, it's kind of disheartening to know (the surveillance program) is going on behind our backs and we don't have a say in it, said Adi Koul (R), a University of Texas student studying abroad in Hong Kong. It's empowering to see people who aren't necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.!-- --/br“As Americans, it’s kind of disheartening to know (the surveillance program) is going on behind our backs and we don’t have a say in it,” said Adi Koul (R), a University of Texas student studying abroad in Hong Kong. “It’s empowering to see people who aren’t necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.”

In a televised interview with Bloomberg on Wednesday on how Hong Kong would handle Snowden's case, Leung repeatedly responded that he does not comment on individual cases. His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.In a televised interview with Bloomberg on Wednesday on how Hong Kong would handle Snowden’s case, Leung repeatedly responded that he “does not comment on individual cases.” His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.

Protesters unfurl a banner en route to the U.S. consulate, where organizers presented an open letter addressed to ambassador Stephen Young. Protesters unfurl a banner en route to the U.S. consulate, where organizers presented an open letter addressed to ambassador Stephen Young.

George Orwell's concept of Big Brother dominated much of the signage and discourse.George Orwell’s concept of “Big Brother” dominated much of the signage and discourse.

Hong Kong legislator Long Hair spoke to the crowd at the second rallying point outside the U.S. consulate.Hong Kong legislator “Long Hair” spoke to the crowd at the second rallying point outside the U.S. consulate.

Police at the Hong Kong government headquarters in Tamar blocked off most of the square with two circles of fences, forcing protesters into a narrow outer perimeter.Police at the Hong Kong government headquarters in Tamar blocked off most of the square with two circles of fences, forcing protesters into a narrow outer perimeter.


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Hong Kong (CNN) — When U.S. citizen Edward Snowden decided to flee to Hong Kong because of its “spirited commitment to free speech and the right of political dissent,” he may not have anticipated that some in the city would launch a protest backing him.

Several hundred demonstrators took to Hong Kong’s streets in the rain Saturday voicing support for Snowden a week after the 29-year-old computer technician, who is believed to be hiding out somewhere in the city, revealed himself as the source of leaked documents exposing an international surveillance program of internet and telephone communications operated by the U.S. National Security Agency (NSA).

The revelation of his presence — as well as his claims that Hong Kong had been subject to the surveillance — has sparked heated speculation whether Hong Kong, a special administrative region — one that is semi-autonomous — of the People’s Republic of China, would prove to be a safe haven for him. Snowden said his intention was to “ask the courts and people of Hong Kong to decide my fate.”


Former U.S. spy talks Snowden’s future


Support for Edward Snowden in Hong Kong


Snowden: U.S. hacked targets in China


Could the NSA leaker defect to China?

“We’re rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law,” said blogger, activist and protest organizer Tom Grundy.

Amid the blowing of whistles and chants of “Protect Snowden!” and “NSA has no say!” the protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public as well as media. Under the drizzling sky, protesters determined to show their support held laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans.

Adi Koul and Jesus Meza, students from the University of Texas at Austin who are studying abroad in Hong Kong, said they found the protest “really refreshing.”

“As Americans, it’s kind of disheartening to know [the surveillance program] is going on behind our backs and we don’t have a say in it,” said Koul. “It’s empowering to see people who aren’t necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.”

Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, aged eight, and three-year-old Jade, along to the protest; the children held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden’s image. “It’s not just about our generation, but the next generation as well,” Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother’s sentiment: “When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.”

Organizers claimed an overall turnout of 900 protesters; police said the demonstration had a peak turnout of 300 — a relatively small showing compared to major protests in Hong Kong, which have attracted hundreds of thousands of people. Grundy said plans for the protest only began on Monday, and that he would be pleased if 1,000 people turned out in the end.

The three-hour protest, which kicked off in a garden in the city’s business district and went on to the U.S. consulate and the Hong Kong government headquarters, failed to gain a strong sense of momentum, hampered in part by the narrow looping route allocated by the city’s authorities. At each rallying point, only a small group was able to gather around to hear the keynote speakers; most protesters were relegated to standing single or double file some distance away. By the time the protest moved outside the government headquarters to deliver an open letter to the city’s leader, Chief Executive C.Y. Leung, the crowd had dropped to about 100 people.

Snowden’s arrival in the city has heightened simmering fears about the ever-encroaching hand of Beijing in the city’s affairs and freedoms.

While Hong Kong has its own de facto constitution, judiciary, and legal system under the “one country two systems” policy, a deep mistrust runs in the city toward the government under Leung, who is widely viewed as being under the thumb of the Chinese central government.

In a televised interview with Bloomberg Wednesday, Leung repeatedly insisted he “does not comment on individual cases,” when asked how Hong Kong would handle Snowden’s case. His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.

“Judging from [this interview], I think he’s waiting for instructions from Beijing,” said Oiwan Lam, a blogger and activist with in-media, the civil advocacy group that organized the protest with Grundy.


Holder: Leaks ‘extremely damaging’


Vetting federal contractors


Inside the mind of Edward Snowden


NSA leaker, girlfriend still in hiding

According to Hong Kong law, if the U.S. was to request the city to surrender Snowden, Beijing could step in only if its defence or foreign affairs would be significantly affected by Hong Kong’s actions. Beijing is not allowed to interfere with any asylum proceedings.

Nevertheless, many have expressed fears that Beijing will quietly influence Hong Kong’s handling of Snowden’s case.

“Hong Kong’s decisions are all based on the Chinese government,” said Sherry Hung, 24, a graduate student at Hong Kong Baptist University. “I don’t think Hong Kong can help Snowden,” she added, although she said it was important to show her support at the protest.

Others also note that Hong Kong has a track record of cooperating with the United States. In particular, they fear Hong Kong will not respect due process in the Snowden case, instead enabling him to be quietly whisked away. Local media in Hong Kong last year reported on the case of a Libyan dissident who launched legal action against the city’s government, accusing them of aiding in his “extraordinary rendition” and subsequent torture in prison.

“The biggest Western government — the U.S government — is his enemy. Now he can only count on us, the power of Hong Kong civil society and our legal system,” Ip Lam Chong of in-media told protesters. “I see this incident as a stress test for Hong Kong society and its legal system.”

Claudia Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature who addressed the protesters, said the city of Hong Kong “owes Snowden at least some response.”

“The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it’s been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale,” she said. “If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is… anyone ever going to start a revolution?”


Article source: http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/15/world/asia/hong-kong-snowden-protest/index.html?eref=edition

Article source: http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/NewsRipplesWeb/~3/Sih-uaPCCzU/hong-kong-rallies-for-edward-snowden

U.S. spy: ‘Snowden is doomed’

Editor’s note: Convicted spy Christopher Boyce was jailed for 40 years for espionage in 1977 after selling U.S. secrets to the Soviet Union. In 1985, his story was turned into a Hollywood film — “The Falcon and the Snowman” – starring Sean Penn and Timothy Hutton. Released in 2003, Boyce is currently working on his memoirs “The Falcon and The Snowman: American Sons.”

(CNN) — Sitting alone in a hotel room, unable to contact friends or family or even walk the teeming streets of Hong Kong without looking over his shoulder, there can be few who can claim to know the fear and isolation that NSA leaker Edward Snowden is living through.

One man, however, is better qualified than most.

Former spy, fugitive and convicted traitor, Christopher Boyce sold U.S. secrets to the former Soviet Union and dodged U.S. authorities for almost two years until his arrest in 1977 at the age of just 22.

Young, idealistic and driven by a mixture of political conviction and outlaw excitement, Boyce eventually received a 40-year sentence for espionage. In 1980, he escaped from the federal penitentiary in Lompoc, California and, while on the run, carried out a string of bank robberies in Idaho and Washington state — crimes for which he says he carries a greater weight of remorse than for those of espionage.

Released on parole in 2003 after serving 25 years, Boyce now lives on America’s West Coast and is working on his memoirs – “The Falcon and The Snowman: American Sons” — scheduled for release this year.

NSA defends surveillance

While Edward Snowden’s leaks allege that U.S. intelligence has been hacking networks around the world for years, the NSA’s stated position is that the administration, Congress and the courts are all aware of and have oversight of the NSA programs exposed by Snowden. NSA has also rejected his claims they can tap into the phone or computer of any U.S. citizen, saying that legally obtained phone records have helped to thwart “dozens” of terrorist events.

In it he outlines how, in 1974, a clean-cut college kid — the son of a respected former FBI agent — lands a job at aerospace and defense firm TRW in Southern California where he sees misrouted Central Intelligence Agency cables that allegedly discuss destabilizing the Australian government — then led by the center-left government of Gough Whitlam.

Whitlam’s government was famously and controversially deposed in 1975 in what some argue amounted to a constitutional coup d’etat. The then governor-general, the British queen’s representative in Australia, Sir John Kerr — who occupied a largely ceremonial office — invoked the rarely-used queen’s reserve powers to fire a democratically elected government to resolve a long-standing political deadlock in the country.

According to accounts by Boyce, the governor-general was casually referred to in CIA circles as “our man, Kerr.”

Only a few years earlier, Australia had been a key U.S. ally in the Vietnam War and Whitlam’s government had already raised ire in Washington by withdrawing Australian troops within hours of taking office in 1972.

By 1975, the Whitlam government was asking uncomfortable questions about key U.S. military installations based in Australia and Boyce claims that the CIA had the Whitlam government firmly in its sights.

Appalled that the U.S. secret services would use its powers of surveillance and secret influence to depose the government of a U.S. ally, Boyce teamed up with a childhood friend — Andrew Daulton Lee — and embarked on a journey that made them one of the Cold War’s most infamous spy teams.

The slow descent of the two former altar boys into a world of mistrust, madness and cold isolation was turned into a Hollywood hit for Sean Penn and Timothy Hutton, who starred in the 1985 movie “The Falcon and The Snowman.”


Inside the mind of Edward Snowden


Trump: Snowden is bad news


Snowden: U.S. hacked targets in China

While 35 years separate his ill-starred foray into espionage and Snowden’s decision to reveal the secret surveillance plans of the National Security Agency (NSA), Boyce told CNN he has a good idea what Snowden might be going through.

“I feel for the guy, and for what his life is going to become. I pity him,” Boyce said.

“He’s in for a world of hurt, for the rest of his life. I feel sorry for him. He’s going to go through life not being able to trust anybody. And I think that in the end, it’ll end badly for him — one way or another, they’ll get their hands on him. He’s going to pay for it. He’s doomed.”

In one of only a handful of interviews Boyce has given since his arrest in 1977, he told CNN this week about his own motivations three decades ago and what Snowden is likely to face psychologically now he is pitted against the world’s most powerful secret service.

CNN: When you see Snowden on the television, do you immediately recognize your situation in it?

Christopher Boyce: The major difference between Snowden and myself is that I didn’t come out publicly with my information. Also, my motives were different. I was sworn to revenge. It certainly was a far different time and place. Up to that point in my life, my view of the (U.S.) Federal Government was that it had only gotten worse.

I grew up in a different time — watching the Kennedy assassination, watching the race riots on television, and watching the U.S. government slide into the Vietnam War — which was, to me, just about the most idiotic, stupid, evil exercise of power my country had ever pulled off.

I went to work as a contractor for the NSA, like Snowden, and what I discovered on the “twixes” (telex messages that were sent back and forth from U.S.-based CIA locations and CIA outposts in Australia) showed that we were undermining the government of Australia, an ally nation.

I don’t know if Snowden views the U.S. government in the same way that I did — maybe he does. He’s uncovered things and made things public that sound, to me, as if they’re illegal. Things that show the NSA and the CIA are lying to Congress. Perhaps in a way it is similar. But what Snowden has done is much different. My aim was to hurt the United States government. I suppose he’s doing that too, but in a public way. Yet he’s not as underhanded about it as I was.

CNN: In the light of his situation, what do you think he could be going through?

Boyce: I think he’s scared to death. I think that every single person he sees, he’s wondering if that’s the person that’s coming for him. He’s probably worried that there is a large group of people in Washington, D.C., trying to come up with some way of getting back at him, to get control of him, to lock him up for the rest of his life.

I don’t know if he has an arrangement with the Chinese government. If he doesn’t, I would be worried that the Chinese may deport him to the United States to gain some concession in return. I’d be terrified of that, if I were him. Who would trust the Chinese government? He is utterly vulnerable and knows that there are a lot of people who really want to hurt him now. If I were him, I would at this point probably be having second thoughts. Asking myself “What did I do? What have I brought down upon my head? Did I really do this?”

The fact is, he can never come back home.

He’s totally separated from everything he has ever known, from his family. He is always going to be a fugitive, until they get him. And eventually, they will. He will never see his family again unless they go to him. And if they do go to him, he’ll no longer be in hiding. The only way that he can truly hide is to abandon his whole past, his entire life.

When he realizes that, he’s going to be racked with depression. I would imagine that his stress levels are at a point where they could actually make him physically sick. I’m sure everything is gnawing at him. And he’s isolated. If I were him, I’d latch onto a couple of reporters that I trusted. He has a lot of enemies now. He has the whole intelligence community of the United States after him, including all of its allies. I sure as hell wouldn’t trust the Chinese government, if I were him.

CNN: At what point, in your case, did you realize there was no going back? Were you fully aware, at the time, of the scope and depth of the trouble you would be in?

Boyce: I realized immediately that there was no stepping back, that I was doomed, and that my life would never go back to the way it was before. I was surrounded by an impending sense of doom, knowing this was something that could not end well. I imagine he will probably start drinking heavily. That’s what I did. Think of it: How much bigger trouble can you possibly get into? How could you make more enemies, more people who would like to kill you, than by doing what he has done? He’s got to be having second thoughts about it. He has to go someplace where he’s safe, and I don’t know if China is it.

CNN: To what extent were you motivated ideologically and to what extent were you motivated by the excitement of being an outlaw? In your opinion, how much ego is involved in the whistleblower’s mindset?

Boyce: Edward Snowden is 29. I was 21. At that age, I felt indestructible. Nothing bad could ever happen to me, or so I thought. You just don’t think about these things when you’re young. You believe that bad things happen to other people. But you learn, after a while, that that’s not true.

My view of the government at the time was that it was just a monstrosity that was getting worse and worse. I didn’t like it. I was motivated to hurt the government. I was nuts. I thought I was going to wage a one-man war against the Federal Government and that I was going to make them pay for all the rotten things they had done and were still doing.

Ego played a great part in that — having my own secrets, being in the know of something, getting (one) over on the bastards. It’s an all-empowering feeling, in a somewhat demented way. But what you’re really doing is just walking into a buzz-saw. It certainly was exciting. I’m sure Snowden feels a similar excitement. But that excitement, after a while, is not a good excitement — it becomes terror.

CNN: Considering the minimal amount of damage the information that you sold to the Soviet Union caused, do you think your sentence was out of all proportion with the crime you committed? There is a sense with these whistleblower cases that the leaker has stepped into a zone where normal laws no longer apply. Do you think the secret services are more interested in exacting revenge in the cases of Assange and Manning than in protecting the interests of the state they serve?

Boyce: Regarding my sentence for espionage, I don’t know if the punishment was disproportionate. That’s for someone else to decide. Of course, I’m a bit prejudiced on that. I certainly think they decided to make an example out of me. There were very few espionage arrests before I was arrested. People never went to court — the government didn’t want these things brought out. In my situation, however, they decided to make an example. And then I escaped from Lompoc federal penitentiary for 19 months. And then I decided to rob some banks. I can say that the sentence I was given for bank robbery was certainly just.

Do I think the government wants revenge against Snowden? Absolutely, they want revenge. They want to ensure anyone who even thinks about doing what he did does so with fear in their hearts.

With respect to these agencies wanting to protect the interests of the states they serve, I ask this question: Is it in the interest of the United States and the American people to have billions of their communications secretly monitored by a government? And to have Congress lied to about it? I don’t think that’s in the interest of the American people. Is the interest of the United States government the same as the interest of the American people? Not always. Not in this situation, anyway.

Of course, there’s still a lot that has to be played out. But I think that revenge is the key driving force by those individuals who stand to get into a heap of trouble as a result of these secrets being made public — the big shot bureaucrats in the national intelligence community. Not that it’s in the interest of the American people to be kept in the dark about it, but simply because of the repercussions those individuals behind the scenes could face. They could be retired early, or lose their pensions, or be disgraced, or be hauled in front of Senate subcommittees, or all manner of bad things. I’m sure there are many things the NSA and CIA don’t want the public to know about, principally because the players behind the scenes could get into serious trouble if it became known.


Article source: http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/14/world/asia/hong-kong-boyce-snowden/index.html?eref=edition

Article source: http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/NewsRipplesWeb/~3/IHg2jLZ2Whw/u-s-spy-snowden-is-doomed

U.S. spy: ‘Snowden is doomed’

Editor’s note: Convicted spy Christopher Boyce was jailed for 40 years for espionage in 1977 after selling U.S. secrets to the Soviet Union. In 1985, his story was turned into a Hollywood film — “The Falcon and the Snowman” – starring Sean Penn and Timothy Hutton. Released in 2003, Boyce is currently working on his memoirs “The Falcon and The Snowman: American Sons.”

(CNN) — Sitting alone in a hotel room, unable to contact friends or family or even walk the teeming streets of Hong Kong without looking over his shoulder, there can be few who can claim to know the fear and isolation that NSA leaker Edward Snowden is living through.

One man, however, is better qualified than most.

Former spy, fugitive and convicted traitor, Christopher Boyce sold U.S. secrets to the former Soviet Union and dodged U.S. authorities for almost two years until his arrest in 1977 at the age of just 22.

Young, idealistic and driven by a mixture of political conviction and outlaw excitement, Boyce eventually received a 40-year sentence for espionage. In 1980, he escaped from the federal penitentiary in Lompoc, California and, while on the run, carried out a string of bank robberies in Idaho and Washington state — crimes for which he says he carries a greater weight of remorse than for those of espionage.

Released on parole in 2003 after serving 25 years, Boyce now lives on America’s West Coast and is working on his memoirs – “The Falcon and The Snowman: American Sons” — scheduled for release this year.

NSA defends surveillance

While Edward Snowden’s leaks allege that U.S. intelligence has been hacking networks around the world for years, the NSA’s stated position is that the administration, Congress and the courts are all aware of and have oversight of the NSA programs exposed by Snowden. NSA has also rejected his claims they can tap into the phone or computer of any U.S. citizen, saying that legally obtained phone records have helped to thwart “dozens” of terrorist events.

In it he outlines how, in 1974, a clean-cut college kid — the son of a respected former FBI agent — lands a job at aerospace and defense firm TRW in Southern California where he sees misrouted Central Intelligence Agency cables that allegedly discuss destabilizing the Australian government — then led by the center-left government of Gough Whitlam.

Whitlam’s government was famously and controversially deposed in 1975 in what some argue amounted to a constitutional coup d’etat. The then governor-general, the British queen’s representative in Australia, Sir John Kerr — who occupied a largely ceremonial office — invoked the rarely-used queen’s reserve powers to fire a democratically elected government to resolve a long-standing political deadlock in the country.

According to accounts by Boyce, the governor-general was casually referred to in CIA circles as “our man, Kerr.”

Only a few years earlier, Australia had been a key U.S. ally in the Vietnam War and Whitlam’s government had already raised ire in Washington by withdrawing Australian troops within hours of taking office in 1972.

By 1975, the Whitlam government was asking uncomfortable questions about key U.S. military installations based in Australia and Boyce claims that the CIA had the Whitlam government firmly in its sights.

Appalled that the U.S. secret services would use its powers of surveillance and secret influence to depose the government of a U.S. ally, Boyce teamed up with a childhood friend — Andrew Daulton Lee — and embarked on a journey that made them one of the Cold War’s most infamous spy teams.

The slow descent of the two former altar boys into a world of mistrust, madness and cold isolation was turned into a Hollywood hit for Sean Penn and Timothy Hutton, who starred in the 1985 movie “The Falcon and The Snowman.”


Inside the mind of Edward Snowden


Trump: Snowden is bad news


Snowden: U.S. hacked targets in China

While 35 years separate his ill-starred foray into espionage and Snowden’s decision to reveal the secret surveillance plans of the National Security Agency (NSA), Boyce told CNN he has a good idea what Snowden might be going through.

“I feel for the guy, and for what his life is going to become. I pity him,” Boyce said.

“He’s in for a world of hurt, for the rest of his life. I feel sorry for him. He’s going to go through life not being able to trust anybody. And I think that in the end, it’ll end badly for him — one way or another, they’ll get their hands on him. He’s going to pay for it. He’s doomed.”

In one of only a handful of interviews Boyce has given since his arrest in 1977, he told CNN this week about his own motivations three decades ago and what Snowden is likely to face psychologically now he is pitted against the world’s most powerful secret service.

CNN: When you see Snowden on the television, do you immediately recognize your situation in it?

Christopher Boyce: The major difference between Snowden and myself is that I didn’t come out publicly with my information. Also, my motives were different. I was sworn to revenge. It certainly was a far different time and place. Up to that point in my life, my view of the (U.S.) Federal Government was that it had only gotten worse.

I grew up in a different time — watching the Kennedy assassination, watching the race riots on television, and watching the U.S. government slide into the Vietnam War — which was, to me, just about the most idiotic, stupid, evil exercise of power my country had ever pulled off.

I went to work as a contractor for the NSA, like Snowden, and what I discovered on the “twixes” (telex messages that were sent back and forth from U.S.-based CIA locations and CIA outposts in Australia) showed that we were undermining the government of Australia, an ally nation.

I don’t know if Snowden views the U.S. government in the same way that I did — maybe he does. He’s uncovered things and made things public that sound, to me, as if they’re illegal. Things that show the NSA and the CIA are lying to Congress. Perhaps in a way it is similar. But what Snowden has done is much different. My aim was to hurt the United States government. I suppose he’s doing that too, but in a public way. Yet he’s not as underhanded about it as I was.

CNN: In the light of his situation, what do you think he could be going through?

Boyce: I think he’s scared to death. I think that every single person he sees, he’s wondering if that’s the person that’s coming for him. He’s probably worried that there is a large group of people in Washington, D.C., trying to come up with some way of getting back at him, to get control of him, to lock him up for the rest of his life.

I don’t know if he has an arrangement with the Chinese government. If he doesn’t, I would be worried that the Chinese may deport him to the United States to gain some concession in return. I’d be terrified of that, if I were him. Who would trust the Chinese government? He is utterly vulnerable and knows that there are a lot of people who really want to hurt him now. If I were him, I would at this point probably be having second thoughts. Asking myself “What did I do? What have I brought down upon my head? Did I really do this?”

The fact is, he can never come back home.

He’s totally separated from everything he has ever known, from his family. He is always going to be a fugitive, until they get him. And eventually, they will. He will never see his family again unless they go to him. And if they do go to him, he’ll no longer be in hiding. The only way that he can truly hide is to abandon his whole past, his entire life.

When he realizes that, he’s going to be racked with depression. I would imagine that his stress levels are at a point where they could actually make him physically sick. I’m sure everything is gnawing at him. And he’s isolated. If I were him, I’d latch onto a couple of reporters that I trusted. He has a lot of enemies now. He has the whole intelligence community of the United States after him, including all of its allies. I sure as hell wouldn’t trust the Chinese government, if I were him.

CNN: At what point, in your case, did you realize there was no going back? Were you fully aware, at the time, of the scope and depth of the trouble you would be in?

Boyce: I realized immediately that there was no stepping back, that I was doomed, and that my life would never go back to the way it was before. I was surrounded by an impending sense of doom, knowing this was something that could not end well. I imagine he will probably start drinking heavily. That’s what I did. Think of it: How much bigger trouble can you possibly get into? How could you make more enemies, more people who would like to kill you, than by doing what he has done? He’s got to be having second thoughts about it. He has to go someplace where he’s safe, and I don’t know if China is it.

CNN: To what extent were you motivated ideologically and to what extent were you motivated by the excitement of being an outlaw? In your opinion, how much ego is involved in the whistleblower’s mindset?

Boyce: Edward Snowden is 29. I was 21. At that age, I felt indestructible. Nothing bad could ever happen to me, or so I thought. You just don’t think about these things when you’re young. You believe that bad things happen to other people. But you learn, after a while, that that’s not true.

My view of the government at the time was that it was just a monstrosity that was getting worse and worse. I didn’t like it. I was motivated to hurt the government. I was nuts. I thought I was going to wage a one-man war against the Federal Government and that I was going to make them pay for all the rotten things they had done and were still doing.

Ego played a great part in that — having my own secrets, being in the know of something, getting (one) over on the bastards. It’s an all-empowering feeling, in a somewhat demented way. But what you’re really doing is just walking into a buzz-saw. It certainly was exciting. I’m sure Snowden feels a similar excitement. But that excitement, after a while, is not a good excitement — it becomes terror.

CNN: Considering the minimal amount of damage the information that you sold to the Soviet Union caused, do you think your sentence was out of all proportion with the crime you committed? There is a sense with these whistleblower cases that the leaker has stepped into a zone where normal laws no longer apply. Do you think the secret services are more interested in exacting revenge in the cases of Assange and Manning than in protecting the interests of the state they serve?

Boyce: Regarding my sentence for espionage, I don’t know if the punishment was disproportionate. That’s for someone else to decide. Of course, I’m a bit prejudiced on that. I certainly think they decided to make an example out of me. There were very few espionage arrests before I was arrested. People never went to court — the government didn’t want these things brought out. In my situation, however, they decided to make an example. And then I escaped from Lompoc federal penitentiary for 19 months. And then I decided to rob some banks. I can say that the sentence I was given for bank robbery was certainly just.

Do I think the government wants revenge against Snowden? Absolutely, they want revenge. They want to ensure anyone who even thinks about doing what he did does so with fear in their hearts.

With respect to these agencies wanting to protect the interests of the states they serve, I ask this question: Is it in the interest of the United States and the American people to have billions of their communications secretly monitored by a government? And to have Congress lied to about it? I don’t think that’s in the interest of the American people. Is the interest of the United States government the same as the interest of the American people? Not always. Not in this situation, anyway.

Of course, there’s still a lot that has to be played out. But I think that revenge is the key driving force by those individuals who stand to get into a heap of trouble as a result of these secrets being made public — the big shot bureaucrats in the national intelligence community. Not that it’s in the interest of the American people to be kept in the dark about it, but simply because of the repercussions those individuals behind the scenes could face. They could be retired early, or lose their pensions, or be disgraced, or be hauled in front of Senate subcommittees, or all manner of bad things. I’m sure there are many things the NSA and CIA don’t want the public to know about, principally because the players behind the scenes could get into serious trouble if it became known.


Article source: http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/14/world/asia/hong-kong-boyce-snowden/index.html?eref=edition

Article source: http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/NewsRipplesWeb/~3/IHg2jLZ2Whw/u-s-spy-snowden-is-doomed

Hong Kong rallies for Snowden


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Several hundred protesters took to Hong Kong's streets on Saturday to support Edward Snowden, a week after the 29-year-old whistleblower behind the U.S. National Security Agency's mass surveillance program revealed he was hiding out in the city.Several hundred protesters took to Hong Kong’s streets on Saturday to support Edward Snowden, a week after the 29-year-old whistleblower behind the U.S. National Security Agency’s mass surveillance program revealed he was hiding out in the city.

The rain led protesters determined to show their support to prepare laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans. The rain led protesters determined to show their support to prepare laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans.

Protesters and media gathered in Chater Garden in the city's business district to kick off the three-hour protest.Protesters and media gathered in Chater Garden in the city’s business district to kick off the three-hour protest.

We're rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law, said blogger-activist and protest co-organizer Tom Grundy (L).“We’re rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law,” said blogger-activist and protest co-organizer Tom Grundy (L).

The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it's been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale. If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is...anyone ever going to start a revolution? said Claudio Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature.“The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it’s been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale. If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is…anyone ever going to start a revolution?” said Claudio Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature.

Standing in Chater Garden in the city's business district, Hong Kong legislator Albert Ho said the protest was a march for justice.Standing in Chater Garden in the city’s business district, Hong Kong legislator Albert Ho said the protest was a “march for justice.”

The protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public and media. The protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public and media.

 Organizers announced an overall turnout of 900 protesters, while police cited a peak turnout of 300. Organizers announced an overall turnout of 900 protesters, while police cited a peak turnout of 300.

Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, 8, and Jade, 3, to the protest, who held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden's image. It's not just about our generation, but the next generation as well, Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother's sentiment: When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, 8, and Jade, 3, to the protest, who held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden’s image. “It’s not just about our generation, but the next generation as well,” Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother’s sentiment: “When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.”

As Americans, it's kind of disheartening to know (the surveillance program) is going on behind our backs and we don't have a say in it, said Adi Koul (R), a University of Texas student studying abroad in Hong Kong. It's empowering to see people who aren't necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.!-- --/br“As Americans, it’s kind of disheartening to know (the surveillance program) is going on behind our backs and we don’t have a say in it,” said Adi Koul (R), a University of Texas student studying abroad in Hong Kong. “It’s empowering to see people who aren’t necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.”

In a televised interview with Bloomberg on Wednesday on how Hong Kong would handle Snowden's case, Leung repeatedly responded that he does not comment on individual cases. His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.In a televised interview with Bloomberg on Wednesday on how Hong Kong would handle Snowden’s case, Leung repeatedly responded that he “does not comment on individual cases.” His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.

Protesters unfurl a banner en route to the U.S. consulate, where organizers presented an open letter addressed to ambassador Stephen Young. Protesters unfurl a banner en route to the U.S. consulate, where organizers presented an open letter addressed to ambassador Stephen Young.

George Orwell's concept of Big Brother dominated much of the signage and discourse.George Orwell’s concept of “Big Brother” dominated much of the signage and discourse.

Hong Kong legislator Long Hair spoke to the crowd at the second rallying point outside the U.S. consulate.Hong Kong legislator “Long Hair” spoke to the crowd at the second rallying point outside the U.S. consulate.

Police at the Hong Kong government headquarters in Tamar blocked off most of the square with two circles of fences, forcing protesters into a narrow outer perimeter.Police at the Hong Kong government headquarters in Tamar blocked off most of the square with two circles of fences, forcing protesters into a narrow outer perimeter.


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Hong Kong (CNN) — When U.S. citizen Edward Snowden decided to flee to Hong Kong because of its “spirited commitment to free speech and the right of political dissent,” he may not have anticipated that some in the city would launch a protest backing him.

Several hundred demonstrators took to Hong Kong’s streets in the rain Saturday voicing support for Snowden a week after the 29-year-old computer technician, who is believed to be hiding out somewhere in the city, revealed himself as the source of leaked documents exposing an international surveillance program of internet and telephone communications operated by the U.S. National Security Agency (NSA).

The revelation of his presence — as well as his claims that Hong Kong had been subject to the surveillance — has sparked heated speculation whether Hong Kong, a special administrative region — one that is semi-autonomous — of the People’s Republic of China, would prove to be a safe haven for him. Snowden said his intention was to “ask the courts and people of Hong Kong to decide my fate.”


Former U.S. spy talks Snowden’s future


Support for Edward Snowden in Hong Kong


Snowden: U.S. hacked targets in China


Could the NSA leaker defect to China?

“We’re rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law,” said blogger, activist and protest organizer Tom Grundy.

Amid the blowing of whistles and chants of “Protect Snowden!” and “NSA has no say!” the protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public as well as media. Under the drizzling sky, protesters determined to show their support held laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans.

Adi Koul and Jesus Meza, students from the University of Texas at Austin who are studying abroad in Hong Kong, said they found the protest “really refreshing.”

“As Americans, it’s kind of disheartening to know [the surveillance program] is going on behind our backs and we don’t have a say in it,” said Koul. “It’s empowering to see people who aren’t necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.”

Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, aged eight, and three-year-old Jade, along to the protest; the children held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden’s image. “It’s not just about our generation, but the next generation as well,” Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother’s sentiment: “When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.”

Organizers claimed an overall turnout of 900 protesters; police said the demonstration had a peak turnout of 300 — a relatively small showing compared to major protests in Hong Kong, which have attracted hundreds of thousands of people. Grundy said plans for the protest only began on Monday, and that he would be pleased if 1,000 people turned out in the end.

The three-hour protest, which kicked off in a garden in the city’s business district and went on to the U.S. consulate and the Hong Kong government headquarters, failed to gain a strong sense of momentum, hampered in part by the narrow looping route allocated by the city’s authorities. At each rallying point, only a small group was able to gather around to hear the keynote speakers; most protesters were relegated to standing single or double file some distance away. By the time the protest moved outside the government headquarters to deliver an open letter to the city’s leader, Chief Executive C.Y. Leung, the crowd had dropped to about 100 people.

Snowden’s arrival in the city has heightened simmering fears about the ever-encroaching hand of Beijing in the city’s affairs and freedoms.

While Hong Kong has its own de facto constitution, judiciary, and legal system under the “one country two systems” policy, a deep mistrust runs in the city toward the government under Leung, who is widely viewed as being under the thumb of the Chinese central government.

In a televised interview with Bloomberg Wednesday, Leung repeatedly insisted he “does not comment on individual cases,” when asked how Hong Kong would handle Snowden’s case. His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.

“Judging from [this interview], I think he’s waiting for instructions from Beijing,” said Oiwan Lam, a blogger and activist with in-media, the civil advocacy group that organized the protest with Grundy.


Holder: Leaks ‘extremely damaging’


Vetting federal contractors


Inside the mind of Edward Snowden


NSA leaker, girlfriend still in hiding

According to Hong Kong law, if the U.S. was to request the city to surrender Snowden, Beijing could step in only if its defence or foreign affairs would be significantly affected by Hong Kong’s actions. Beijing is not allowed to interfere with any asylum proceedings.

Nevertheless, many have expressed fears that Beijing will quietly influence Hong Kong’s handling of Snowden’s case.

“Hong Kong’s decisions are all based on the Chinese government,” said Sherry Hung, 24, a graduate student at Hong Kong Baptist University. “I don’t think Hong Kong can help Snowden,” she added, although she said it was important to show her support at the protest.

Others also note that Hong Kong has a track record of cooperating with the United States. In particular, they fear Hong Kong will not respect due process in the Snowden case, instead enabling him to be quietly whisked away. Local media in Hong Kong last year reported on the case of a Libyan dissident who launched legal action against the city’s government, accusing them of aiding in his “extraordinary rendition” and subsequent torture in prison.

“The biggest Western government — the U.S government — is his enemy. Now he can only count on us, the power of Hong Kong civil society and our legal system,” Ip Lam Chong of in-media told protesters. “I see this incident as a stress test for Hong Kong society and its legal system.”

Claudia Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature who addressed the protesters, said the city of Hong Kong “owes Snowden at least some response.”

“The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it’s been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale,” she said. “If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is… anyone ever going to start a revolution?”


Article source: http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/15/world/asia/hong-kong-snowden-protest/index.html?eref=edition

Article source: http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/NewsRipplesWeb/~3/-4-IVGgJj4w/hong-kong-rallies-for-snowden

Hong Kong rallies for Snowden


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Several hundred protesters took to Hong Kong's streets on Saturday to support Edward Snowden, a week after the 29-year-old whistleblower behind the U.S. National Security Agency's mass surveillance program revealed he was hiding out in the city.Several hundred protesters took to Hong Kong’s streets on Saturday to support Edward Snowden, a week after the 29-year-old whistleblower behind the U.S. National Security Agency’s mass surveillance program revealed he was hiding out in the city.

The rain led protesters determined to show their support to prepare laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans. The rain led protesters determined to show their support to prepare laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans.

Protesters and media gathered in Chater Garden in the city's business district to kick off the three-hour protest.Protesters and media gathered in Chater Garden in the city’s business district to kick off the three-hour protest.

We're rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law, said blogger-activist and protest co-organizer Tom Grundy (L).“We’re rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law,” said blogger-activist and protest co-organizer Tom Grundy (L).

The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it's been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale. If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is...anyone ever going to start a revolution? said Claudio Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature.“The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it’s been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale. If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is…anyone ever going to start a revolution?” said Claudio Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature.

Standing in Chater Garden in the city's business district, Hong Kong legislator Albert Ho said the protest was a march for justice.Standing in Chater Garden in the city’s business district, Hong Kong legislator Albert Ho said the protest was a “march for justice.”

The protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public and media. The protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public and media.

 Organizers announced an overall turnout of 900 protesters, while police cited a peak turnout of 300. Organizers announced an overall turnout of 900 protesters, while police cited a peak turnout of 300.

Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, 8, and Jade, 3, to the protest, who held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden's image. It's not just about our generation, but the next generation as well, Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother's sentiment: When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, 8, and Jade, 3, to the protest, who held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden’s image. “It’s not just about our generation, but the next generation as well,” Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother’s sentiment: “When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.”

As Americans, it's kind of disheartening to know (the surveillance program) is going on behind our backs and we don't have a say in it, said Adi Koul (R), a University of Texas student studying abroad in Hong Kong. It's empowering to see people who aren't necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.!-- --/br“As Americans, it’s kind of disheartening to know (the surveillance program) is going on behind our backs and we don’t have a say in it,” said Adi Koul (R), a University of Texas student studying abroad in Hong Kong. “It’s empowering to see people who aren’t necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.”

In a televised interview with Bloomberg on Wednesday on how Hong Kong would handle Snowden's case, Leung repeatedly responded that he does not comment on individual cases. His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.In a televised interview with Bloomberg on Wednesday on how Hong Kong would handle Snowden’s case, Leung repeatedly responded that he “does not comment on individual cases.” His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.

Protesters unfurl a banner en route to the U.S. consulate, where organizers presented an open letter addressed to ambassador Stephen Young. Protesters unfurl a banner en route to the U.S. consulate, where organizers presented an open letter addressed to ambassador Stephen Young.

George Orwell's concept of Big Brother dominated much of the signage and discourse.George Orwell’s concept of “Big Brother” dominated much of the signage and discourse.

Hong Kong legislator Long Hair spoke to the crowd at the second rallying point outside the U.S. consulate.Hong Kong legislator “Long Hair” spoke to the crowd at the second rallying point outside the U.S. consulate.

Police at the Hong Kong government headquarters in Tamar blocked off most of the square with two circles of fences, forcing protesters into a narrow outer perimeter.Police at the Hong Kong government headquarters in Tamar blocked off most of the square with two circles of fences, forcing protesters into a narrow outer perimeter.


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Hong Kong (CNN) — When U.S. citizen Edward Snowden decided to flee to Hong Kong because of its “spirited commitment to free speech and the right of political dissent,” he may not have anticipated that some in the city would launch a protest backing him.

Several hundred demonstrators took to Hong Kong’s streets in the rain Saturday voicing support for Snowden a week after the 29-year-old computer technician, who is believed to be hiding out somewhere in the city, revealed himself as the source of leaked documents exposing an international surveillance program of internet and telephone communications operated by the U.S. National Security Agency (NSA).

The revelation of his presence — as well as his claims that Hong Kong had been subject to the surveillance — has sparked heated speculation whether Hong Kong, a special administrative region — one that is semi-autonomous — of the People’s Republic of China, would prove to be a safe haven for him. Snowden said his intention was to “ask the courts and people of Hong Kong to decide my fate.”


Former U.S. spy talks Snowden’s future


Support for Edward Snowden in Hong Kong


Snowden: U.S. hacked targets in China


Could the NSA leaker defect to China?

“We’re rallying in order not to disappoint him and to ask Hong Kong to protect his well-being, not to extradite him, and to uphold Hong Kong law,” said blogger, activist and protest organizer Tom Grundy.

Amid the blowing of whistles and chants of “Protect Snowden!” and “NSA has no say!” the protest brought together representatives from 27 civil rights, labor rights, and left-wing democratic groups, as well as many ordinary members of the public as well as media. Under the drizzling sky, protesters determined to show their support held laminated placards and umbrellas painted with slogans.

Adi Koul and Jesus Meza, students from the University of Texas at Austin who are studying abroad in Hong Kong, said they found the protest “really refreshing.”

“As Americans, it’s kind of disheartening to know [the surveillance program] is going on behind our backs and we don’t have a say in it,” said Koul. “It’s empowering to see people who aren’t necessarily American fighting for something they feel is a universal human right.”

Ruth Jopling brought her daughters, Amber, aged eight, and three-year-old Jade, along to the protest; the children held cut-out masks on sticks bearing Snowden’s image. “It’s not just about our generation, but the next generation as well,” Jopling said. Amber echoed her mother’s sentiment: “When I grow up, I can tell my children about this.”

Organizers claimed an overall turnout of 900 protesters; police said the demonstration had a peak turnout of 300 — a relatively small showing compared to major protests in Hong Kong, which have attracted hundreds of thousands of people. Grundy said plans for the protest only began on Monday, and that he would be pleased if 1,000 people turned out in the end.

The three-hour protest, which kicked off in a garden in the city’s business district and went on to the U.S. consulate and the Hong Kong government headquarters, failed to gain a strong sense of momentum, hampered in part by the narrow looping route allocated by the city’s authorities. At each rallying point, only a small group was able to gather around to hear the keynote speakers; most protesters were relegated to standing single or double file some distance away. By the time the protest moved outside the government headquarters to deliver an open letter to the city’s leader, Chief Executive C.Y. Leung, the crowd had dropped to about 100 people.

Snowden’s arrival in the city has heightened simmering fears about the ever-encroaching hand of Beijing in the city’s affairs and freedoms.

While Hong Kong has its own de facto constitution, judiciary, and legal system under the “one country two systems” policy, a deep mistrust runs in the city toward the government under Leung, who is widely viewed as being under the thumb of the Chinese central government.

In a televised interview with Bloomberg Wednesday, Leung repeatedly insisted he “does not comment on individual cases,” when asked how Hong Kong would handle Snowden’s case. His stonewalling infuriated many Hong Kongers.

“Judging from [this interview], I think he’s waiting for instructions from Beijing,” said Oiwan Lam, a blogger and activist with in-media, the civil advocacy group that organized the protest with Grundy.


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According to Hong Kong law, if the U.S. was to request the city to surrender Snowden, Beijing could step in only if its defence or foreign affairs would be significantly affected by Hong Kong’s actions. Beijing is not allowed to interfere with any asylum proceedings.

Nevertheless, many have expressed fears that Beijing will quietly influence Hong Kong’s handling of Snowden’s case.

“Hong Kong’s decisions are all based on the Chinese government,” said Sherry Hung, 24, a graduate student at Hong Kong Baptist University. “I don’t think Hong Kong can help Snowden,” she added, although she said it was important to show her support at the protest.

Others also note that Hong Kong has a track record of cooperating with the United States. In particular, they fear Hong Kong will not respect due process in the Snowden case, instead enabling him to be quietly whisked away. Local media in Hong Kong last year reported on the case of a Libyan dissident who launched legal action against the city’s government, accusing them of aiding in his “extraordinary rendition” and subsequent torture in prison.

“The biggest Western government — the U.S government — is his enemy. Now he can only count on us, the power of Hong Kong civil society and our legal system,” Ip Lam Chong of in-media told protesters. “I see this incident as a stress test for Hong Kong society and its legal system.”

Claudia Mo, a member of the Hong Kong legislature who addressed the protesters, said the city of Hong Kong “owes Snowden at least some response.”

“The U.S is supposed to be the champion of democracy, but it’s been conducting blanket surveillance on a global scale,” she said. “If the guy at the top has access to all our lines of communication, how is… anyone ever going to start a revolution?”


Article source: http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/15/world/asia/hong-kong-snowden-protest/index.html?eref=edition

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Convicted U.S. spy: ‘Snowden is doomed’


Christopher Boyce, left, was jailed for 40 years in 1977 for espionage. He says he pities Snowden.

Editor’s note: Convicted spy Christopher Boyce was jailed for 40 years for espionage in 1977 after selling U.S. secrets to the Soviet Union. In 1985, his story was turned into a Hollywood film — “The Falcon and the Snowman” – starring Sean Penn and Timothy Hutton. Released in 2003, Boyce is currently working on his memoirs “The Falcon and The Snowman: American Sons.”

(CNN) — Sitting alone in a hotel room, unable to contact friends or family or even walk the teeming streets of Hong Kong without looking over his shoulder, there can be few who can claim to know the fear and isolation that NSA leaker Edward Snowden is living through.

One man, however, is better qualified than most.

Former spy, fugitive and convicted traitor, Christopher Boyce sold U.S. secrets to the former Soviet Union and dodged U.S. authorities for almost two years until his arrest in 1977 at the age of just 22.

Young, idealistic and driven by a mixture of political conviction and outlaw excitement, Boyce eventually received a 40-year sentence for espionage. In 1980, he escaped from the federal penitentiary in Lompoc, California and, while on the run, carried out a string of bank robberies in Idaho and Washington state — crimes for which he says he carries a greater weight of remorse than for those of espionage.

Released on parole in 2003 after serving 25 years, Boyce now lives on America’s West Coast and is working on his memoirs – “The Falcon and The Snowman: American Sons” — scheduled for release this year.

NSA defends surveillance

While Edward Snowden’s leaks allege that U.S. intelligence has been hacking networks around the world for years, the NSA’s stated position is that the administration, Congress and the courts are all aware of and have oversight of the NSA programs exposed by Snowden. NSA has also rejected his claims they can tap into the phone or computer of any U.S. citizen, saying that legally obtained phone records have helped to thwart “dozens” of terrorist events.

In it he outlines how, in 1974, a clean-cut college kid — the son of a respected former FBI agent — lands a job at aerospace and defense firm TRW in Southern California where he sees misrouted Central Intelligence Agency cables that allegedly discuss destabilizing the Australian government — then led by the center-left government of Gough Whitlam.

Whitlam’s government was famously and controversially deposed in 1975 in what some argue amounted to a constitutional coup d’etat. The then governor-general, the British queen’s representative in Australia, Sir John Kerr — who occupied a largely ceremonial office — invoked the rarely-used queen’s reserve powers to fire a democratically elected government to resolve a long-standing political deadlock in the country.

According to accounts by Boyce, the governor-general was casually referred to in CIA circles as “our man, Kerr.”

Only a few years earlier, Australia had been a key U.S. ally in the Vietnam War and Whitlam’s government had already raised ire in Washington by withdrawing Australian troops within hours of taking office in 1972.

By 1975, the Whitlam government was asking uncomfortable questions about key U.S. military installations based in Australia and Boyce claims that the CIA had the Whitlam government firmly in its sights.

Appalled that the U.S. secret services would use its powers of surveillance and secret influence to depose the government of a U.S. ally, Boyce teamed up with a childhood friend — Andrew Daulton Lee — and embarked on a journey that made them one of the Cold War’s most infamous spy teams.

The slow descent of the two former altar boys into a world of mistrust, madness and cold isolation was turned into a Hollywood hit for Sean Penn and Timothy Hutton, who starred in the 1985 movie “The Falcon and The Snowman.”


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While 35 years separate his ill-starred foray into espionage and Snowden’s decision to reveal the secret surveillance plans of the National Security Agency (NSA), Boyce told CNN he has a good idea what Snowden might be going through.

“I feel for the guy, and for what his life is going to become. I pity him,” Boyce said.

“He’s in for a world of hurt, for the rest of his life. I feel sorry for him. He’s going to go through life not being able to trust anybody. And I think that in the end, it’ll end badly for him — one way or another, they’ll get their hands on him. He’s going to pay for it. He’s doomed.”

In one of only a handful of interviews Boyce has given since his arrest in 1977, he told CNN this week about his own motivations three decades ago and what Snowden is likely to face psychologically now he is pitted against the world’s most powerful secret service.

CNN: When you see Snowden on the television, do you immediately recognize your situation in it?

Christopher Boyce: The major difference between Snowden and myself is that I didn’t come out publicly with my information. Also, my motives were different. I was sworn to revenge. It certainly was a far different time and place. Up to that point in my life, my view of the (U.S.) Federal Government was that it had only gotten worse.

I grew up in a different time — watching the Kennedy assassination, watching the race riots on television, and watching the U.S. government slide into the Vietnam War — which was, to me, just about the most idiotic, stupid, evil exercise of power my country had ever pulled off.

I went to work as a contractor for the NSA, like Snowden, and what I discovered on the “twixes” (telex messages that were sent back and forth from U.S.-based CIA locations and CIA outposts in Australia) showed that we were undermining the government of Australia, an ally nation.

I don’t know if Snowden views the U.S. government in the same way that I did — maybe he does. He’s uncovered things and made things public that sound, to me, as if they’re illegal. Things that show the NSA and the CIA are lying to Congress. Perhaps in a way it is similar. But what Snowden has done is much different. My aim was to hurt the United States government. I suppose he’s doing that too, but in a public way. Yet he’s not as underhanded about it as I was.

CNN: In the light of his situation, what do you think he could be going through?

Boyce: I think he’s scared to death. I think that every single person he sees, he’s wondering if that’s the person that’s coming for him. He’s probably worried that there is a large group of people in Washington, D.C., trying to come up with some way of getting back at him, to get control of him, to lock him up for the rest of his life.

I don’t know if he has an arrangement with the Chinese government. If he doesn’t, I would be worried that the Chinese may deport him to the United States to gain some concession in return. I’d be terrified of that, if I were him. Who would trust the Chinese government? He is utterly vulnerable and knows that there are a lot of people who really want to hurt him now. If I were him, I would at this point probably be having second thoughts. Asking myself “What did I do? What have I brought down upon my head? Did I really do this?”

The fact is, he can never come back home.

He’s totally separated from everything he has ever known, from his family. He is always going to be a fugitive, until they get him. And eventually, they will. He will never see his family again unless they go to him. And if they do go to him, he’ll no longer be in hiding. The only way that he can truly hide is to abandon his whole past, his entire life.

When he realizes that, he’s going to be racked with depression. I would imagine that his stress levels are at a point where they could actually make him physically sick. I’m sure everything is gnawing at him. And he’s isolated. If I were him, I’d latch onto a couple of reporters that I trusted. He has a lot of enemies now. He has the whole intelligence community of the United States after him, including all of its allies. I sure as hell wouldn’t trust the Chinese government, if I were him.

CNN: At what point, in your case, did you realize there was no going back? Were you fully aware, at the time, of the scope and depth of the trouble you would be in?

Boyce: I realized immediately that there was no stepping back, that I was doomed, and that my life would never go back to the way it was before. I was surrounded by an impending sense of doom, knowing this was something that could not end well. I imagine he will probably start drinking heavily. That’s what I did. Think of it: How much bigger trouble can you possibly get into? How could you make more enemies, more people who would like to kill you, than by doing what he has done? He’s got to be having second thoughts about it. He has to go someplace where he’s safe, and I don’t know if China is it.

CNN: To what extent were you motivated ideologically and to what extent were you motivated by the excitement of being an outlaw? In your opinion, how much ego is involved in the whistleblower’s mindset?

Boyce: Edward Snowden is 29. I was 21. At that age, I felt indestructible. Nothing bad could ever happen to me, or so I thought. You just don’t think about these things when you’re young. You believe that bad things happen to other people. But you learn, after a while, that that’s not true.

My view of the government at the time was that it was just a monstrosity that was getting worse and worse. I didn’t like it. I was motivated to hurt the government. I was nuts. I thought I was going to wage a one-man war against the Federal Government and that I was going to make them pay for all the rotten things they had done and were still doing.

Ego played a great part in that — having my own secrets, being in the know of something, getting (one) over on the bastards. It’s an all-empowering feeling, in a somewhat demented way. But what you’re really doing is just walking into a buzz-saw. It certainly was exciting. I’m sure Snowden feels a similar excitement. But that excitement, after a while, is not a good excitement — it becomes terror.

CNN: Considering the minimal amount of damage the information that you sold to the Soviet Union caused, do you think your sentence was out of all proportion with the crime you committed? There is a sense with these whistleblower cases that the leaker has stepped into a zone where normal laws no longer apply. Do you think the secret services are more interested in exacting revenge in the cases of Assange and Manning than in protecting the interests of the state they serve?

Boyce: Regarding my sentence for espionage, I don’t know if the punishment was disproportionate. That’s for someone else to decide. Of course, I’m a bit prejudiced on that. I certainly think they decided to make an example out of me. There were very few espionage arrests before I was arrested. People never went to court — the government didn’t want these things brought out. In my situation, however, they decided to make an example. And then I escaped from Lompoc federal penitentiary for 19 months. And then I decided to rob some banks. I can say that the sentence I was given for bank robbery was certainly just.

Do I think the government wants revenge against Snowden? Absolutely, they want revenge. They want to ensure anyone who even thinks about doing what he did does so with fear in their hearts.

With respect to these agencies wanting to protect the interests of the states they serve, I ask this question: Is it in the interest of the United States and the American people to have billions of their communications secretly monitored by a government? And to have Congress lied to about it? I don’t think that’s in the interest of the American people. Is the interest of the United States government the same as the interest of the American people? Not always. Not in this situation, anyway.

Of course, there’s still a lot that has to be played out. But I think that revenge is the key driving force by those individuals who stand to get into a heap of trouble as a result of these secrets being made public — the big shot bureaucrats in the national intelligence community. Not that it’s in the interest of the American people to be kept in the dark about it, but simply because of the repercussions those individuals behind the scenes could face. They could be retired early, or lose their pensions, or be disgraced, or be hauled in front of Senate subcommittees, or all manner of bad things. I’m sure there are many things the NSA and CIA don’t want the public to know about, principally because the players behind the scenes could get into serious trouble if it became known.


Article source: http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/14/world/asia/hong-kong-boyce-snowden/index.html?eref=edition

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